Alyeska's toboggan CPR

Comments

  • NELSBEERNELSBEER advanced
    Posts: 223
    There is always a lot of discussion about alternatives. Size of the mountain, time to next level of care and other factors all enter in to decisions.

    If you look at the film carefully you will notice that the toboggan bring used looks like a regular orange Cascade unit, but look at the bend of the handles and you'll see that this is actually a wider model designed for big patients and CPR. 2 tail ropes are not the norm on regular togs. You would expect to find these units at very big (high) mountains with long runs to base.  There have also been cases where 2 regular togs are clipped together allowing a patroller in one to do CPR on a patient in the other (this gets you 2 tail ropes as well). CPR & AED use on a moving sled is a challenge, there is a tradeoff of speed for a smoother ride. Steep bumpy trails would be a problem as well.

    For smaller mountains the norm would be something like: check ABC's (airway breathing circulation) by shouting and checking pulse at the neck (most exposed veins on a wrapped up skier), call for sled/assistance, request ALS ambulance and commence chest compressions. Compressions are continued until a sled arrives, a quick transfer is done and compressions continue. When the sled is ready to run stop compressions, let it go a few hundred yards where another patroller does compressions. Continue down the hill alternating compressions and movement. O2 can wait, it makes the process more complex, adds less value & takes time.

    At the bottom O2, an AED, blankets, a gurney and staff would be waiting to do full patient care until EMT's arrive.

    Either method has it's place.  The good news is doctors have told us a ski area is a good place to have your heart attack due to the trained quick response. (not soliciting business)..


      
      
  • ski_itski_it expert
    Posts: 1,653
    Well couldn't ask for a more beautiful spot & day to drop dead while Overlooking the Turnagain Arm wasteland. I wonder if they waited for a day when the tide was somewhat in before filming?
    ISNE-I Skied New England | NESAP-the New England Ski Area Project | SOSA-Saving Our Ski Areas - Location SW of Boston MA
  • tededetedede advanced
    Posts: 121
    The patient would be far better off with an AED applied in the first 3-5 minutes.

    In the video they are using 7 patrollers.  I don't think most large resorts have 7 available within 5 minutes.

  • NELSBEERNELSBEER advanced
    edited April 6 Posts: 223
    Like I said, best practices are a frequent subject of discussion... Alyeska applies the AED on the hill & uses a special sled with a lot of people; a lot of things to bring together. Alter the weather and terrain could be a challenge.

    Could we, at a smaller area, make 3-5 minutes with 3-4 patrollers?  ...could be a race in the making!
     
  • rickbolgerrickbolger expert
    Posts: 1,061
    Saw CPR being done on a moving sled at Killington back in December.  I thought it was a drill, sadly no.  Don't know if they had any additional equipment for that particular event.

    Most of us seldom give a thought to the incredible array of problems/ailments/injuries/situations that patrol has to deal with.  And then after the fact, we really don't get an opportunity to properly say "thank you" to the patroller(s) who help. 
  • bmwskierbmwskier advanced
    Posts: 322
    It's a bitch to do--- I've run a sled in practice and the double weight up near the lobster claws of the sled makes it hard to maneuver and pick up to pull the chain. Added to that it's top heavy and the tail roper has to have their eyes on all of the time. 

    Even on a fairly easy trail all I did was sweat it out with the lightest person in the sled. There's the patroller, the patient, the O2, an AED and then the newer Cascades are literally twice the weight of the older ones. 

    "Making ski films is being irresponsible with other people's money, in a responsible sort of way..." 
    Greg Stump
  • ski_itski_it expert
    edited April 7 Posts: 1,653
    Well said Rick, in paragraph two.
    Thank you patrollers.
    ISNE-I Skied New England | NESAP-the New England Ski Area Project | SOSA-Saving Our Ski Areas - Location SW of Boston MA
  • ciscokidciscokid expert
    Posts: 1,378
    ski_it said:

    Well said Rick, in paragraph two.
    Thank you patrollers.

    +1
    How long are them sleds anyway?
  • bmwskierbmwskier advanced
    Posts: 322
    "Making ski films is being irresponsible with other people's money, in a responsible sort of way..." 
    Greg Stump
  • obienickobienick expert
    Posts: 853
    Wow those are expensive.  What gives?
  • tededetedede advanced
    Posts: 121
    obienick said:

    Wow those are expensive.  What gives?

    As Nelson mentioned it's a larger, custom sled. It's almost 3 feet longer and 10 inches wider than the stock Legend.  

    I suspect the demand is limited and small production runs drive up supply cost.

    Also, if you look at their website you'll see the standard sled is sold out indicating their demand exceeds their supply and pricing becomes less of an issue.

    I agree it's a large nut for a piece of rescue equipment.


  • bmwskierbmwskier advanced
    Posts: 322
    Norwich had two or three Cascades, two shure-stops and one old Sun Valley. Never found out what happened to them once the area closed. Buildings and Grounds had no idea either. My guess is either someone took them as a tow behind for their snomobile or they're just rotting somewhere on campus. 

    "Making ski films is being irresponsible with other people's money, in a responsible sort of way..." 
    Greg Stump
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