Mt. Snow's West Lake Work Renewed

TomWhiteTomWhite advanced
in NELSAP Forum Posts: 357

I was viewing their Cartintia web cam and noticed a bunch of
snowmaking pipe. Sure enough they have a new entry on their West Lake Project
blog:

 

SATURDAY, APRIL 15,
2017

Our West Lake Project is back on the front burner, and we are
turning the heat up to high! This summer we will install the inflatable dam,
build three pumphouses (one at West Lake, at the base of Cartinthia and up
around the trail Drop) and connect our underground pipeline from West Lake
heading north on Coldbrook Rd and connecting at the Wilmington/Dover town line
with the pipeline we installed two summers ago.

We started ramping back up on Monday, April 10th, at the West Lake Pump house.  Our general
contractor, G.W. Tatro, prepped materials (maybe you have seen the massive
24" pipe laid out) on Coldbrook Road.  

The Coldbrook Road closure will begin on 4/17/17 at the West
Lake Pump house, and moving to the North.  We expect to make it to the
Mann Rd/Coldbrook intersection around 5/1.  Here is our anticipated
schedule.

Comments

  • mtsnow123mtsnow123 advanced
    Posts: 277
    Yes, those snow mounds are huge. I see the snowmaking pipes. Coldbrook Road in the area is closed during the day for construction. I'm very excited to see the lake to fill up.
  • sugarloafsugarloaf expert
    Posts: 743
    Widening of Long John has also started as per their Facebook page.

    Ski Conditions Report: A detailed report describing the snow conditions on the mountain the day of your visit. Skiers should become familiar with the following snow surface descriptions: Ice: Packed Powder, Slush: Packed Powder, Frozen Granular: Packed Powder , Packed Powder - A thin covering of snow over bare earth.

  • slathamslatham intermediate
    Posts: 86
    Widening a section of Long John too. They've made huge investments in uphill capacity- about time they started to expand downhill, snowmaking covered, capacity.
  • DrJeffDrJeff advanced
    Posts: 264
    slatham said:

    Widening a section of Long John too. They've made huge investments in uphill capacity- about time they started to expand downhill, snowmaking covered, capacity.

    They had wanted to make that change to Long John for a while..... At first it was held up for a few years due to permitting red tape (no real surprise there as that part of the mountain is on US Forest Service Land) and then they, Peak, had the funding issues for a little while due to the EB-5 hold up and their short term cash flow issues...  Atleast that's the public line I've heard for it's delay of this needed widening
  • joshua_segaljoshua_segal expert
    Posts: 1,551
    I think Mt. Snow does an incredible job of covering Long John early in the season.  While I don't know what the crowds might be like on a weekend, it seems as though the combination of Long John + Little John +  the Sun Brook Area should be adequate to handle the Green Circle/Low-end Blue Square crowd.  

  • slathamslatham intermediate
    Posts: 86

    I think Mt. Snow does an incredible job of covering Long John early in the season.  While I don't know what the crowds might be like on a weekend, it seems as though the combination of Long John + Little John +  the Sun Brook Area should be adequate to handle the Green Circle/Low-end Blue Square crowd.  




    While the upper combo of Long John + Little John + Natural Long John is marginally adequate, the lower section, which is only Long John, is not even close to having adequate "throughput". While they always have adequate snowmaking coverage, there is not enough width to safely handle the flow of skiers, especially given the combo on beginners (its the ONLY green off the summit) and more advanced skiers heading to Carinthia.

    As for the "delay" in doing this work, I buy the permitting argument, but not EB-5. The project is not that costly.

  • joshua_segaljoshua_segal expert
    Posts: 1,551
    slatham said:

    I think Mt. Snow does an incredible job of covering Long John early in the season.  While I don't know what the crowds might be like on a weekend, it seems as though the combination of Long John + Little John +  the Sun Brook Area should be adequate to handle the Green Circle/Low-end Blue Square crowd.  




    While the upper combo of Long John + Little John + Natural Long John is marginally adequate, the lower section, which is only Long John, is not even close to having adequate "throughput". While they always have adequate snowmaking coverage, there is not enough width to safely handle the flow of skiers, especially given the combo on beginners (its the ONLY green off the summit) and more advanced skiers heading to Carinthia.

    As for the "delay" in doing this work, I buy the permitting argument, but not EB-5. The project is not that costly.

    So it is only the section from Carinthia to the Main Lodge that you are talking about widening?

    I know in NH, blasting that includes more than some number of cubic yards of material (In don't remember the number) requires permitting and in VT, I suspect getting the permits is even harder.
    slatham said:

    Widening a section of Long John too. They've made huge investments in uphill capacity- about time they started to expand downhill, snowmaking covered, capacity.

    I'm not sure Mt. Snow owns undeveloped skiable land on which to add downhill capacity.  I wonder what you had in mind?
  • mapnutmapnut expert
    Posts: 726
    They could add snowmaking to some East Face runs that don't have it, and IMO run the Sundance chair more often to encourage people to ski those runs. That would also get people off Long John between the summit and the top of Sundance.
  • ski_itski_it expert
    Posts: 1,548

    Little John always seem more crowded than LJ on the weekends. Most novices tend to head that way instead of taking the top of Long John IMHO. Usually advanced yahoos blasting thru there with novices zig zagging there way down. Is my recollection correct that the trails can reconnect at the top of the Sundance chair? Or may be I'm remembering that as another choke/danger point... I agree with Mapnut that running the Sundance more often would help, but being a mid mtn chair I'm sure they see it differently. As for terrain, I've been eyeing that peak above and west of Sunbrook. Of course they probably do not own it. I'm guessing and only guessing, that locals hike & ski up there from off the lifts 

        

    ISNE-I Skied New England | NESAP-the New England Ski Area Project | SOSA-Saving Our Ski Areas - Location SW of Boston MA
  • mapnutmapnut expert
    Posts: 726
    Further west of the North Face has a bit more vertical and a nice mix of pitches, as long as we're dreaming.
  • obienickobienick expert
    Posts: 790
    I think the widening was always unofficially tied to the snowmaking improvements. You don't widen a key route if you already struggle with [relatively] limited water and/or pumping capacity.

    Do the new pumphouses increase pumping? Higher pressures?
  • jaytremjaytrem intermediate
    Posts: 53

    slatham said:

    I'm not sure Mt. Snow owns undeveloped skiable land on which to add downhill capacity.  I wonder what you had in mind?

    At least one of their recent master plans had additional North Face runs past Olympic along and I think a new trail into Sunbrook off Long John.  Been a while since I looked at the map, I'll have to try to dig it up.  North Face permit boundry would potentially allow for another lift with the base being further west than the existing North Face lifts.  Probably been 15 years since I've heard any mention of that being a thought, and the runs on the last map I saw went back to the current North Face base.  Unfortunately the new runs would do a job on the tree skiing out that way.  So I'm probably not infavor of it.  I'm still upset about Plummet screwing up Jaws and PDF.
  • mapnutmapnut expert
    Posts: 726

    You've been upset since 1989?

    I'd probably find a lot of things to be upset about if I ever get back to Sugarloaf.

  • mtsnow123mtsnow123 advanced
    Posts: 277
    The photos from Kelly's blog on the trail widening are super cool and very descriptive: Link.
  • newpylongnewpylong advanced
    edited April 21 Posts: 452
    obienick said:

    I think the widening was always unofficially tied to the snowmaking improvements. You don't widen a key route if you already struggle with [relatively] limited water and/or pumping capacity.

    Do the new pumphouses increase pumping? Higher pressures?

    Not more pressure per se but more water (gpm). They laid a new larger uphill main up Ridge in anticipation a couple years back. Would assume all water will now come up the road and go to the new pump house in Carinthia, some will keep going up a leg to the new mid mountain pump house by Drop and some will go directly onto Carinthia. Then a leg up to the summit up Ridge from there, some may go directly on the hill from Drop. Calling Dr Jeff to correct me, but that's my recollection.

  • slathamslatham intermediate
    Posts: 86
    From the blog today they are widening from the Summit to top of Carinthia.

    My comment about the need for more down hill capacity was specifically the need to widen Long John, and to add snowmaking capability to existing terrain to offer more open terrain. I was not suggesting they cut more trails or otherwise expand.
  • ski_itski_it expert
    Posts: 1,548
    thks for the Link MtSnow123. Wow they're going all the way thru those ledges, huh? Are they making a 2nd Boulevard of Broken Dreams (Snowdance is the 1st)?
    ISNE-I Skied New England | NESAP-the New England Ski Area Project | SOSA-Saving Our Ski Areas - Location SW of Boston MA
  • DrJeffDrJeff advanced
    Posts: 264
    newpylong said:

    obienick said:

    I think the widening was always unofficially tied to the snowmaking improvements. You don't widen a key route if you already struggle with [relatively] limited water and/or pumping capacity.

    Do the new pumphouses increase pumping? Higher pressures?

    Not more pressure per se but more water (gpm). They laid a new larger uphill main up Ridge in anticipation a couple years back. Would assume all water will now come up the road and go to the new pump house in Carinthia, some will keep going up a leg to the new mid mountain pump house by Drop and some will go directly onto Carinthia. Then a leg up to the summit up Ridge from there, some may go directly on the hill from Drop. Calling Dr Jeff to correct me, but that's my recollection.

    That's exactly how I recall the plan!

    Being up at Mount Snow right now and having driven through both the Carinthia and Main Base areas this evening, there got to be literally a couple of miles of new snowmaking in sizes ranging from what looks to be close to 24" in diameter on down to 4-6" diameter pipe stack all around the Carinthia lots, as well as a bunch of pump components.

    In the main base area near the Mtn Ops building, they've atleast temporarily moved the cooling towers from their air plant and are storing them across the parking lot, near where they usually store the cats in the summer, and there's WAY more large sized pump components still in shipping wrap in the lot next to Mtn Ops and on the pad where the cooling towers usually are, as well as some segments of what looked to be a solid 12" diameter new pipe stacked for installation in the same area!! Lots of stuff already going on at Mount Snow this off season!!
  • jaytremjaytrem intermediate
    Posts: 53
    mapnut said:

    You've been upset since 1989?

    I'd probably find a lot of things to be upset about if I ever get back to Sugarloaf.

    Yup, North Face was a lot more "classic" before Plummet and Freefall.  The lift was needed, so I can forgive Freefall.  As for Plummet...REVEGETATE NOW!!!  :-)
  • DrJeffDrJeff advanced
    Posts: 264
    Just some pictures I snapped today off the work already going on in and around Mount Snow currently
    IMG_20170422_173937113.jpg
    5248 x 2952 - 5M
    IMG_20170422_173915962.jpg
    5248 x 2952 - 6M
    IMG_20170422_173837059.jpg
    5248 x 2952 - 6M
    IMG_20170422_173432203.jpg
    5248 x 2952 - 6M
    IMG_20170422_173326806.jpg
    5248 x 2952 - 6M
    IMG_20170422_173249709.jpg
    5248 x 2952 - 5M
    IMG_20170422_172600752.jpg
    2952 x 5248 - 4M
  • newpylongnewpylong advanced
    Posts: 452
    That is one monster manifold
  • slathamslatham intermediate
    Posts: 86
    Thanks Dr Jeff! Impressive amount of working going on at Mt Snow this summer.
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