Despite the amenities and "big hill feeling" at Dartmouth Skiway I would argue they don't belong in regional ski areas. They exist purely to serve the college, both the alpine teams and PE programs (the college cuts them a $400-600K) check a year to cover operating loss. They do not market themselves whatsoever, they have very little water to use for snowmaking, and their yearly skier visits are down in the feeder category. Though it also might be a long stretch to put them in that category.
Despite the amenities and "big hill feeling" at Dartmouth Skiway I would argue they don't belong in regional ski areas. They exist purely to serve the college, both the alpine teams and PE programs (the college cuts them a $400-600K) check a year to cover operating loss. They do not market themselves whatsoever, they have very little water to use for snowmaking, and their yearly skier visits are down in the feeder category. Though it also might be a long stretch to put them in that category.
I think it fits because the draw of Dartmouth is over a larger area than a feeder area would be. Liftopia and Ski NH deals also help bring in skiers from a good part of the Connecticut River Valley and beyond.
Here's my Maine list. I think that Maine is interesting because there are a number of surface-lift-only areas that I feel qualify for the feeder area category instead of the local tow category. I also think some of the regional ski areas simply qualify because of the distance to another ski area.
Private Areas - O'Connor - Pinnacle
Local Ski Tows - Baker Mountain - Eaton Mountain - Powderhouse Hill - Quoggy Jo - Sprice Mountain
Feeder Areas - Hermon Mountain - Mount Jefferson - Lonesome Pine Trails - Lost Valley - Titcomb Mountain
Regional Ski Areas - Mount Abram - Big Rock - Big Squaw - Black Mountain - Camden Snow Bowl
Regional Resorts - Shawnee Peak
Large Ski Areas *none* (Saddleback would fit in this category)
Despite the amenities and "big hill feeling" at Dartmouth Skiway I would argue they don't belong in regional ski areas. They exist purely to serve the college, both the alpine teams and PE programs (the college cuts them a $400-600K) check a year to cover operating loss. They do not market themselves whatsoever, they have very little water to use for snowmaking, and their yearly skier visits are down in the feeder category. Though it also might be a long stretch to put them in that category.
I think it fits because the draw of Dartmouth is over a larger area than a feeder area would be. Liftopia and Ski NH deals also help bring in skiers from a good part of the Connecticut River Valley and beyond.
You're lucky to run into anyone that doesn't live in Lyme or go to the college during the week there. The weekends aren't much busier. There is no way that the Skiway belongs in the category of Ragged, Crotched, Pat's, etc and the yearly visits show it. I know of very few outside of those on ski forums who would drive any type of distance to the Skiway. There are other areas like Whaleback that are on Liftopia and also members of Ski New Hampshire, yet I don't consider regional ski areas either. Perhaps there needs to be a "local areas" grouping that includes feeder areas, which Dartmouth certainly would align better with.
Despite the amenities and "big hill feeling" at Dartmouth Skiway I would argue they don't belong in regional ski areas. They exist purely to serve the college, both the alpine teams and PE programs (the college cuts them a $400-600K) check a year to cover operating loss. They do not market themselves whatsoever, they have very little water to use for snowmaking, and their yearly skier visits are down in the feeder category. Though it also might be a long stretch to put them in that category.
I think it fits because the draw of Dartmouth is over a larger area than a feeder area would be. Liftopia and Ski NH deals also help bring in skiers from a good part of the Connecticut River Valley and beyond.
You're lucky to run into anyone that doesn't live in Lyme or go to the college during the week there. The weekends aren't much busier. There is no way that the Skiway belongs in the category of Ragged, Crotched, Pat's, etc and the yearly visits show it. I know of very few outside of those on ski forums who would drive any type of distance to the Skiway. There are other areas like Whaleback that are on Liftopia and also members of Ski New Hampshire, yet I don't consider regional ski areas either. Perhaps there needs to be a "local areas" grouping that includes feeder areas, which Dartmouth certainly would align better with.
My .02
What I suggested was because every time I go there I often meet numerous people on the lift who drive 1.2+ hours to get there.
People routinely travel from the UK to stay and ski at Attitash, heck I travel from NJ to ski and stay at Attitash. There are condos all over the place, and a big hotel that fills up nicely on weekends.
If that doesn't qualify as a destination ski resort, what does?
I'd also flip Cannon to Large Ski Area. If it qualifies as Destination Resort by virtue of all the housing down in Lincoln, then Wildcat does too because of North Conway.
I'd also flip Cannon to Large Ski Area. If it qualifies as Destination Resort by virtue of all the housing down in Lincoln, then Wildcat does too because of North Conway.
Cannon does have lodging right there at Mittersill and in Franconia.
Here's my Maine list. I think that Maine is interesting because there are a number of surface-lift-only areas that I feel qualify for the feeder area category instead of the local tow category. I also think some of the regional ski areas simply qualify because of the distance to another ski area.
Private Areas - O'Connor - Pinnacle
Local Ski Tows - Baker Mountain - Eaton Mountain - Powderhouse Hill - Quoggy Jo - Sprice Mountain
Feeder Areas - Hermon Mountain - Mount Jefferson - Lonesome Pine Trails - Lost Valley - Titcomb Mountain
Regional Ski Areas - Mount Abram - Big Rock - Big Squaw - Black Mountain - Camden Snow Bowl
Regional Resorts - Shawnee Peak
Large Ski Areas *none* (Saddleback would fit in this category)
Destination Resorts - Sugarloaf - Sunday River
Re, NES13's ME list; my only disagreement is with Big Squaw. I'd drop it to feeder. (If they get the upper lift running, it would be a large ski area.)
Here's my Maine list. I think that Maine is interesting because there are a number of surface-lift-only areas that I feel qualify for the feeder area category instead of the local tow category. I also think some of the regional ski areas simply qualify because of the distance to another ski area.
Private Areas - O'Connor - Pinnacle
Local Ski Tows - Baker Mountain - Eaton Mountain - Powderhouse Hill - Quoggy Jo - Sprice Mountain
Feeder Areas - Hermon Mountain - Mount Jefferson - Lonesome Pine Trails - Lost Valley - Titcomb Mountain
Regional Ski Areas - Mount Abram - Big Rock - Big Squaw - Black Mountain - Camden Snow Bowl
Regional Resorts - Shawnee Peak
Large Ski Areas *none* (Saddleback would fit in this category)
Destination Resorts - Sugarloaf - Sunday River
Re, NES13's ME list; my only disagreement is with Big Squaw. I'd drop it to feeder. (If they get the upper lift running, it would be a large ski area.)
That makes sense, the only reason why I said regional was because its the only ski area in the entire region.
Based on what I see in their base area development, I'd call Jiminy a destination. Lots of weekenders and ski weekers...
I definitely would not consider it a destination. To fit the destination category we've been using, it would have to attract people on vacation from multiple states away and/or foreign skiers. People ski there because it's relatively close and convenient, not because it's a large destination resort.
Jiminy is most definitely a destination. It does attract from far, though I am unsure how. All that slopeside lodging and amenities do not exist at mountains with only local draw.
The Berkshire resorts are an interesting case. I 've known a number of people from ny/nj that have second homes up there. All ski at least a bit, but often the focus was a place to get away to. The whole area is loaded with folks from further south any time of the year though.
The Berkshire resorts are an interesting case. I 've known a number of people from ny/nj that have second homes up there. All ski at least a bit, but often the focus was a place to get away to. The whole area is loaded with folks from further south any time of the year though.
This is true. Whenever one sets up categories, there are always some that fall on the cusp between a couple of categories. Based on the arbitrary aspect of the definition of 1500' vertical for a destination resort, no MA, CT or RI area could be a destination resort. (Graylock Glen might have been if it was completed.)
Greylock Glen was only ~750 vertical at max build out.
Interesting. I thought the Thunderbolt went 1700' vertical, so I made the incorrect assumption that GG might have had that amount of vertical. Petersburg Pass, nominally in the Berkshires, had the potential for 1600+, but it was really an NY area.
I think the vertical requirement for destination is not needed. Look at Holiday Valley or any of a number of those WNY areas, Seven Springs, PA, or places in the midwest- people have second homes/condos on or near the mountain, and they do big multi-day vacation business, not just daytrippers. Jiminy is MA's only true destination resort, a la others nearby (Mt. Snow, Stratton), just smaller ski area.
Greylock Glen was only ~750 vertical at max build out.
Interesting. I thought the Thunderbolt went 1700' vertical, so I made the incorrect assumption that GG might have had that amount of vertical. Petersburg Pass, nominally in the Berkshires, had the potential for 1600+, but it was really an NY area.
It was only built on the lower shoulder of the mountain (Northern side).
Jiminy is most definitely a destination. It does attract from far, though I am unsure how. All that slopeside lodging and amenities do not exist at mountains with only local draw.
I'm headed there for a destination wedding in a couple weeks, does that count?
Seriously though I never thought of it in the same league as a Loon or Bretton Woods or Mount Snow
I think the vertical requirement for destination is not needed. Look at Holiday Valley or any of a number of those WNY areas, Seven Springs, PA, or places in the midwest- people have second homes/condos on or near the mountain, and they do big multi-day vacation business, not just daytrippers. Jiminy is MA's only true destination resort, a la others nearby (Mt. Snow, Stratton), just smaller ski area.
We'll get to NY and PA. Holiday Valley will be an interesting argument when we get there. For now we've done MA, NH and ME.
For now, if the area doesn't have 1500' of vertical, we're not letting them into the "destination resort category".
Comments
Where would we put Balsams-Wilderness?
They aren't open and who knows when they will be.
I suggest Maine next
I think it fits because the draw of Dartmouth is over a larger area than a feeder area would be. Liftopia and Ski NH deals also help bring in skiers from a good part of the Connecticut River Valley and beyond.
Private Areas
- O'Connor
- Pinnacle
Local Ski Tows
- Baker Mountain
- Eaton Mountain
- Powderhouse Hill
- Quoggy Jo
- Sprice Mountain
Feeder Areas
- Hermon Mountain
- Mount Jefferson
- Lonesome Pine Trails
- Lost Valley
- Titcomb Mountain
Regional Ski Areas
- Mount Abram
- Big Rock
- Big Squaw
- Black Mountain
- Camden Snow Bowl
Regional Resorts
- Shawnee Peak
Large Ski Areas
*none* (Saddleback would fit in this category)
Destination Resorts
- Sugarloaf
- Sunday River
What I suggested was because every time I go there I often meet numerous people on the lift who drive 1.2+ hours to get there.
That makes sense, the only reason why I said regional was because its the only ski area in the entire region.
Private Areas
- Easton
- Mount Greylock
- Waidlich Tow
Local Ski Tows
- Osceloa
Feeder Areas
- Blandford
- Blue Hills
- Bradford
- Nashoba Valley
- Otis Ridge
- Ward
Regional Ski Areas
- Berkshire East
- Bousquet
- Butternut
- Catamount
Regional Ski Resorts
- Jiminy Peak
- Wachusetts
Large Ski Areas
*none*
Destination Resorts
*none*
I definitely would not consider it a destination. To fit the destination category we've been using, it would have to attract people on vacation from multiple states away and/or foreign skiers. People ski there because it's relatively close and convenient, not because it's a large destination resort.