Betsy
NELSAP
Thanks Betsy for sharing!
This stuck out for me:
Resorts must collect the name, phone number, and email address in an electronic format of all people using the resort each day, and retain the list for 30 days for the purposes of contact tracing. This list must include all guests using the resort, including season pass holders.Whenever possible, the resort should include the guest’s physical address.•
This will be quite an order, especially for smaller hills without that resource.
Resorts must require guests to attest that the guest will be in compliance with the state’s travel and quarantine policies when they use the resort either at the point of sale of a ticket or season pass OR when collecting contact tracing information. Resorts must be able to demonstrate to state authorities that each guest completed an attestation. Attestations must include a warning that failure to comply with the state’s travel and quarantine policy may result in the loss of future skiing and riding privileges
This is likely to drastically cut down on any out of state travel aside from the few distant counties in green. Looks like every guest with have to attest to this each and every day of skiing or visit.
Resorts should collect names, phone numbers, email addresses and addresses in electronic form of all users of a day-use lodge, when they used the lodge, and where they sat, and retain the list for 30 days.
Where they sat? Yikes, how is that going to be tracked? How is that possibly going to be collected when thousands of people may use lodges each day?
jgreco
NELSAP;c-44266 wrote
This is likely to drastically cut down on any out of state...
You have way more faith in people than I do. I think most people will either consider it a white lie or feel that their unique circumstances make them special enough that the rules don't apply to them.
NELSAP;c-44266 wrote
Where they sat?
3rd stall :smiley:
NELSAP
I would think a lot would just lie and get away with it - but they are going to be verifying your address, phone # which could easily be investigated if the state feels like it. Heck, they're going to know your phone number and address if you sit at Table 32, seat 1.
slatham
I am not surprised about gathering info upon check in as I believe hotels and restaurants do this now. Certainly makes the argument for a reservation system stronger as that info would be collected beforehand (and only once for repeat customers).
I think the attestation will deter only a few who otherwise would have "bent" the rules. But the majority of those who will feel compelled to bend the rules will do it anyhow.
Where you sat in the lodge? Depends upon how specific - hopefully it's generic. Otherwise the person checking you in will have to scan the lodge and tell the person where to sit and make note of it.
jgreco
NELSAP;c-44268 wroteI would think a lot would just lie and get away with it - but they are going to be verifying your address, phone # which could easily be investigated if the state feels like it. Heck, they're going to know your phone number and address if you sit at Table 32, seat 1.
I guess it comes down to how actively they enforce it? As someone mentioned in another forum, if you're at a bigger mountain skiing on a pass or ticket that has your home address tied to it in the system, it would be easy to find people who are making day or weekend trips from out of state. Although, none of it may matter at this rate. I'd put a dollar on the season not making it past January 8th for most mountains.
lotsoskiing
Just stay out of base lodges. Boot up at your car, use lodge for rest rooms only, and go home when done skiing. The new normal and maybe all we get this year.
NELSBEER
The line about loss of skiing privileges.. could they require a pass be suspended for Vermont use? That puts a lot more leverage on the requirement.
Attestations must include a warning that failure to comply with the state’s travel and quarantine policy may result in the loss of future skiing and riding privileges
The staff needed for universal enforcement would be prohibitive, but if you are one of the token number caught and held up as examples... Sort of like Massachusetts police catching Alcohol and Fireworks 'smugglers'.
Whenever possible, the resort should include the guest’s physical address.• closes the loop on season pass holders.
riverc0il
lotsoskiing;c-44273 wroteJust stay out of base lodges. Boot up at your car, use lodge for rest rooms only, and go home when done skiing. The new normal and maybe all we get this year.
The wording of this latest "mandatory guidance" suggests that resorts must document every guest. Even if you are booting up at your car on a season pass and never go near a lodge, you still need to be documented with full attestation info/certification. Not saying people will not try to get around it, not saying the resorts will be able to do it... but the wording suggests resorts are responsible for fully enforcing the travel restrictions for everyone visiting the area.
slatham
riverc0il;c-44282 wrotelotsoskiing;c-44273 wroteJust stay out of base lodges. Boot up at your car, use lodge for rest rooms only, and go home when done skiing. The new normal and maybe all we get this year.
The wording of this latest "mandatory guidance" suggests that resorts must document every guest. Even if you are booting up at your car on a season pass and never go near a lodge, you still need to be documented with full attestation info/certification. Not saying people will not try to get around it, not saying the resorts will be able to do it... but the wording suggests resorts are responsible for fully enforcing the travel restrictions for everyone visiting the area.
That is how I read it too - everyone on mountain accounted for. It really argues for an online reservation system even for pass holders to capture this data. Except for RFID areas which capture it every time you ride a lift (though they'll have to add attestation language).
NewEnglandSkier13
This is silly. Even though I'm in a green county on their map, I probably won't ski in Vermont this season due to all of these hoops to jump through.
lotsoskiing
Everyone needs to take a deep breath (while masked) and realize that this will not be in place forever, and if everyone plays the game, the ski areas can stay open. If they don't and the state closes them down, then they've screwed themselves. For one season (hopefully that's all it is), people will have to give up the opportunity to ski whenever, wherever they want. A small price to pay for the opportunity to get out on the slopes this year.
slatham
NewEnglandSkier13;c-44285 wroteThis is silly. Even though I'm in a green county on their map, I probably won't ski in Vermont this season due to all of these hoops to jump through.
Why? The extra data VT requires can be painlessly gathered when reserving and buying a ticket online. The rest of the regs seem very consistent with everywhere else.
NewEnglandSkier13
slatham;c-44291 wroteNewEnglandSkier13;c-44285 wroteThis is silly. Even though I'm in a green county on their map, I probably won't ski in Vermont this season due to all of these hoops to jump through.
Why? The extra data VT requires can be painlessly gathered when reserving and buying a ticket online. The rest of the regs seem very consistent with everywhere else.
I don't like having to purchase and or reserve everything ahead of time and having lodge use extremely restricted. Not to mention the multiple times per visit that it seems they will be required to collect personal information.
DrJeff
NewEnglandSkier13;c-44293 wroteslatham;c-44291 wroteNewEnglandSkier13;c-44285 wroteThis is silly. Even though I'm in a green county on their map, I probably won't ski in Vermont this season due to all of these hoops to jump through.
Why? The extra data VT requires can be painlessly gathered when reserving and buying a ticket online. The rest of the regs seem very consistent with everywhere else.
I don't like having to purchase and or reserve everything ahead of time and having lodge use extremely restricted. Not to mention the multiple times per visit that it seems they will be required to collect personal information.
If one has personal autonomy issues, this certainly will create a conundrum for them
teighs
"You have way more faith in people than I do. I think most people will either consider it a white lie or feel that their unique circumstances make them special enough that the rules don't apply to them."
No really people will follow the rules, I've never seen anyone ski a closed trail...
lotsoskiing
Time to take up backcountry skiing, at least for a season, if these rules are too onerous. Patience, all.
slatham
This situation is the poster child for negative selection. Those that are following protocols and staying safe are the same people who will follow the rules and not travel to VT. Those that don't care and ignore protocols will also ignore the travel restrictions and will travel to VT. They will also probably not follow protocols when in VT.
Thats government policy for you.......
lotsoskiing
slatham;c-44297 wroteThis situation is the poster child for negative selection. Those that are following protocols and staying safe are the same people who will follow the rules and not travel to VT. Those that don't care and ignore protocols will also ignore the travel restrictions and will travel to VT. They will also probably not follow protocols when in VT.
Thats government policy for you.......
And, that's how the pandemic gets prolonged. Terrific.
NewEnglandSkier13
Now over half of Vermont doesn't meet its own travel requirements.
