Stratton's Snow Bowl Poma Quad lift is heading to Magic!

Dougmccarthy

BIG NEWS: Stratton’s Snow Bowl Poma Quad lift is heading to Magic to replace Black Chair!

Here’s the press release from this morning below. This a major investment by SKI MAGIC LLC in our mountain’s future and in improving your experience here as skiers and riders. Lift lines to the absolute minimum, reliable family-oriented lift service, and keeping our slopes free of heavy traffic! We plan to have this Quad lift operating for the 2018-19 season (pending permitting), along with our new base-to-mid mountain Green Double. Thank you for all your support by making plans to ski and ride here at Magic!

Press Release:

Stratton’s Snow Bowl Poma Quad Lift Heading Across the Valley to Magic Mountain

–Another Major Upgrade by SKI MAGIC LLC Will Replace Magic’s Current Black Chair Summit Lift–

Londonderry, VT, May 9, 2018 – Magic Mountain is purchasing and installing Stratton’s current “Snow Bowl” Poma fixed-grip quad chairlift as a new base-to-summit lift for the 2018/19 season. The Poma quad lift will replace Magic’s current “Black Chair” which had been operating as a double passenger capacity lift. The new lift at Magic will follow a similar lift line up the Black Line trail to the summit with a slightly higher terminal station in order to access all trails at Magic.

Magic’s new Poma quad lift, originally built in 1986 and installed at Stratton’s Snow Bowl area, comes with 148 chairs, a 2,000 skier per hour capacity, and has an excellent performance and maintenance record at Stratton. It will service approximately 1,500 vertical feet with the lift line stretching about 5,000 feet long. The lift will add significant uphill capacity in combination with Magic’s current “Red Chair” double summit lift and another new installation to be completed this off season of a base-to-mid mountain Borvig double passenger lift (“Green Chair”). The current Black Chair, which the Poma Quad will replace, only had 113 chairs, was approved as a two-person carrier, and therefore had a maximum capacity of just 620 riders per hour. The Poma Quad therefore effectively triples Magic’s uphill capacity over the current lift.

“When we heard Stratton was replacing their Snow Bowl lift with a new high-speed detachable, four-passenger lift, our investor group jumped on the opportunity to try and purchase their Poma fixed-grip quad”, said Geoff Hatheway, President of SKI MAGIC LLC. “For our ski community, this lift is a huge upgrade that meets and manages our current and future growth expectations, better fulfills customer desires for quality, reliable lift service at Magic, and sustains our reputation as an area with both minimal lift lines and low on-slope skier density.”

Stratton is taking down the Snow Bowl lift this month and then Magic will have the lift transported across the valley (about 15 miles) to its Londonderry location.

“It’s great to see this dependable lift live on in southern Vermont, and I want to acknowledge Bill Nupp, President and COO of Stratton, and all our neighbors there for making this purchase happen”, continued Geoff Hatheway. “We occupy a very different place in the industry than Stratton, but Bill and his team really wanted to make this possible for us. It’s a true example of the big guy on the block helping the little guy out and supporting the diversity of experiences uniquely available here in southern Vermont—all within just a few miles of each other.”

Magic plans for its lift contractors to begin work this summer and fall on the new summit Black Line Poma Quad, after the installation is complete on the mid-mountain Green Lift. Magic will operate the new quad as the primary summit lift every weekend and holiday period, with the famed Red Chair continuing as an additional lift on busy weekends plus pulling main duty on lighter traffic weekdays.

In total, this will be a major $1 million capital investment in the new lift by SKI MAGIC LLC which will help attract more skiers and riders to the southern Vermont and Windham County region who are interested in a classic, old-school mountain vibe.

–End Release–

- Geoff

SKI MAGIC LLC

Where skiing still has its soul.

sugarloaf

Excellent news, it’s nice to see a major resort help out a smaller mom and pop.

NewEnglandSkier13

This will be good for Magic and I knew it was bound to happen at some point, but with the two new lifts, I envision more trail crowding and I don’t think Magic will be as attractive to me anymore.

NELSAP

I don’t know how bad the trail crowding might be…a 2000 skier/hr capacity is about the same as the West Mtn triple (1600-1800 per hour), and the other triple is a lot less, 1000 or so, so 2800 skiers per hour - even with the lifts mostly full, the trails stay quite reasonable. 2-3 quads to top would be different.But this is great news….we all love funky lifts, but that frankenlift was going to become unusable soon. JD

shpride

Looks like you can buy old black chairs for $300 each.

So exciting news. We will keep you all posted throughout the “off” season on both lift projects and our snowmaking pond expansion project. Also, the actual Black Chairs from the old lift will be available for purchase for $300/chair. If you’d like to reserve one or two, please email info@magicmtn.com with your phone number. 

z1000307470

<blockquote class=“Quote” rel=“NewEnglandSkier13”>This will be good for Magic and I knew it was bound to happen at some point, but with the two new lifts, I envision more trail crowding and I don’t think Magic will be as attractive to me anymore.</blockquote>

Good luck to finding someplace better and less crowded in SVT. This lift will still be around a 12 minute ride. If every chair is filled, that is 300 people on the lift and not on the trails.This is great news.

Remski

Excellent Magic LLC. Doing it right reliably is key here.

lotsoskiing

Can someone explain the economics behind keeping the red lift, too? I get having a backup, but I doubt it will ever be crowded enough (especially if the green chair comes on line) to really need it. Seems like a lot of maintenance cost for a lift that is likely not going to be used much. I am thinking of the Willoughby Chair at Burke- rendered useless by a parallel (essentially) quad.

Or maybe it costs less to keep standing and maintained than to tear down and find a buyer?

MrMagic

<blockquote class=“Quote” rel=“z1000307470”><blockquote 9class=“Quote” rel=“NewEnglandSkier13”>This will be good for Magic and I knew it was bound to happen at some point, but with the two new lifts, I envision more trail crowding and I don’t think Magic will be as attractive to me anymore.</blockquote>

Yes this is great news usually I’m not for these massive ski areas upgrade from doubles to high speed 6 person bubble lifts that more and more ski areas are doing , as I really don’t mind riding slow chairs and I rather have a few less runs with good snow then a ton of runs with boiler plate. However there comes a time when lifts NEED to be replaced and this is one of them. Black chair while not “unsafe” certainly had a lot of issues and cosmeticly needed some work so it’s a great investment and opportunity for the mountain and the industry. To say the area is unattractive because of this lift improvement is crazy. Your entitled to your own thoughts , but good luck finding better terrain at that price south of MRG.

Sully

<blockquote class=“Quote” rel=“lotsoskiing”>Can someone explain the economics behind keeping the red lift, too? I get having a backup, but I doubt it will ever be crowded enough (especially if the green chair comes on line) to really need it. Seems like a lot of maintenance cost for a lift that is likely not going to be used much. I am thinking of the Willoughby Chair at Burke- rendered useless by a parallel (essentially) quad.

Or maybe it costs less to keep standing and maintained than to tear down and find a buyer?

</blockquote>

If you’ve never been to Magic or talked/heard/read how the locals speak of Red you would know it is not a matter of economics, it’s a matter of love. There is only one other lift in the region that gets more respect. And overall it really is a true classic that is in pretty good shape after years and years of maintenance. Now that it will be the backup lift she can live on forever! 

lotsoskiing

<blockquote class=“Quote” rel=“Sully”><blockquote class=“Quote” rel=“lotsoskiing”>Can someone explain the economics behind keeping the red lift, too? I get having a backup, but I doubt it will ever be crowded enough (especially if the green chair comes on line) to really need it. Seems like a lot of maintenance cost for a lift that is likely not going to be used much. I am thinking of the Willoughby Chair at Burke- rendered useless by a parallel (essentially) quad.

Or maybe it costs less to keep standing and maintained than to tear down and find a buyer?

</blockquote>

Correct, I have never been to Magic, though it is on my list and has been for years. However, you can’t keep a place running on love alone, and I was just curious how having a lift sit idle, yet have to have the requisite (and not cheap) maintenance, can pay off. If nostalgia pays the bills, then I guess that’s reason enough to keep it. They must feel it is worth keeping, so point taken. 

NELSAP

Remember too - Snowjournal/SJ sponsored the painting of Chair 98 on the Red Chair :)

slatham

The Red chair will not sit idle. It will run during the week (Thur/Fri) as it is more economical and the Quad capacity not needed. It will also run on busy weekends/holidays. And no matter how good the new Quad is you need a back up. Removimg it would be nonsensical on a number of fronts. And loyal locals cherish Red. So it will be a key operating lift for years to come.

newpylong

<blockquote class=“Quote” rel=“lotsoskiing”><blockquote class=“Quote” rel=“Sully”><blockquote class=“Quote” rel=“lotsoskiing”>Can someone explain the economics behind keeping the red lift, too? I get having a backup, but I doubt it will ever be crowded enough (especially if the green chair comes on line) to really need it. Seems like a lot of maintenance cost for a lift that is likely not going to be used much. I am thinking of the Willoughby Chair at Burke- rendered useless by a parallel (essentially) quad.

Or maybe it costs less to keep standing and maintained than to tear down and find a buyer?

</blockquote>

It will not be a Burke/Willoughby situation. Think Bluebird/GSE at Mount Snow. Complementary lifts and both needed.

NewEnglandSkier13

<blockquote class=“Quote” rel=“z1000307470”><blockquote class=“Quote” rel=“NewEnglandSkier13”>This will be good for Magic and I knew it was bound to happen at some point, but with the two new lifts, I envision more trail crowding and I don’t think Magic will be as attractive to me anymore.</blockquote>

I agree that it will still be one of the best options in the area. What I’m saying is that it takes me almost 3 hours to drive to Magic one way. With the new quad, I will now be more likely to choose other areas, such as Dartmouth, Black, Tenney, and Mount Abram. I wonder if/how much this will affect the vibe of the area.

TomWhite

<blockquote class=“Quote” rel=“newpylong”><blockquote class=“Quote” rel=“lotsoskiing”><blockquote class=“Quote” rel=“Sully”><blockquote class=“Quote” rel=“lotsoskiing”>Can someone explain the economics behind keeping the red lift, too? I get having a backup, but I doubt it will ever be crowded enough (especially if the green chair comes on line) to really need it. Seems like a lot of maintenance cost for a lift that is likely not going to be used much. I am thinking of the Willoughby Chair at Burke- rendered useless by a parallel (essentially) quad.

Or maybe it costs less to keep standing and maintained than to tear down and find a buyer?

</blockquote></blockquote></blockquote>

It will not be a Burke/Willoughby situation. Think Bluebird/GSE at Mount Snow. Complementary lifts and both needed.</blockquote>

<blockquote class=“Quote” rel=“slatham”>The Red chair will not sit idle. It will run during the week (Thur/Fri) as it is more economical and the Quad capacity not needed. It will also run on busy weekends/holidays. And no matter how good the new Quad is you need a back up. Removimg it would be nonsensical on a number of fronts. And loyal locals cherish Red. So it will be a key operating lift for years to come. </blockquote>

If it’s already there, and in good shape, a back-up is a good idea. I think it was around Christmas 1986 when Stowe installed their Forerunner HSQ. In advance they removed the Mansfield double. I guess the single had been removed earlier. I was in the lift line at Stratton with Stowe season pass holders. Their new lift wasn’t running. I heard people say, “If only they kept the double, we could reach the summit.” They finally figured out that one or both bull wheels (I don’t recall) were the wrong size. So having a back-up lift, if it’s there and usable, is a good thing.

lotsoskiing

Or maybe it costs less to keep standing and maintained than to tear down and find a buyer?

</blockquote>

It will not be a Burke/Willoughby situation. Think Bluebird/GSE at Mount Snow. Complementary lifts and both needed.</blockquote>

I believe the Willoughby lift never ran after quad installed, then was (is to be?) removed.

JMaul

Money Well Spent.

TomWhite

The second half of the Liftblog.com article is nothing new. But there is a 4 min. video. Magic staff ride the Red Chair talking about this summer’s work. They say $1.6 mill., the same as the article. I think that includes finishing the Green Chair and snowmaking pond expansion. So Stratton gave them a great deal. In the comments (included below), there’s a question about a loading carpet and line speed. 485 fpm is fast w/o a carpet, but where did that figure come from? So I looked at Liftblog’s stats for the Snow Bowl, they say 550 fpm. That’s not correct for a FGQ.

Two New Lifts Are Coming to Magic Mountain

May 9, 2018 Peter Landsman 11 Comments

They call it “the road less traveled,” a classic Vermont mountain situated about half way between Stratton and Okemo.  Now in its second year of new ownership, Magic Mountain has carved a successful niche offering top quality, affordable skiing despite a competitive landscape.  Ski Magic LLC added a new carpet lift and restarted work on a new double chair to service intermediate terrain soon after taking over operations in late 2016.  Fresh off a successful 2017-18 season with increased skier visits, investors plan to spend an impressive $1.6 million on key infrastructure this summer including two important new chairlifts.

In addition to completing the Green Chair project by early summer, Magic announced today that a Poma quad chair will replace the Black lift, which dates back to the middle of last century.  The 1962 Pohlig double was once converted to a triple with Yan chairs before being turned back into a double in recent years.  Today it sports towers from Pohlig, Hall and possibly Poma and the time has finally come to retire it.

Any idea if the new Black Line chair will have a loading carpet? 485 fpm over 5000 ft is an awful lot quicker in terms of ride time than 450 (or less)…

Jonni

<blockquote class=“Quote” rel=“lotsoskiing”>Or maybe it costs less to keep standing and maintained than to tear down and find a buyer?</blockquote>

Yes, this is correct. It it much more expensive to remove a lift than it is to maintain it. Exhibit A: The Duckling Double at Sunapee. There have been many rumors of it being removed and it is even suggested on the 10 year master plan. It’s just far cheaper to put $10,000 into it (or whatever it may cost to maintain and license), vs $100,000 or more to remove it.