Vail Stinks 2020/2021

yardsale

here is what Vail didn't tell us today:

Mt. Snow is sold out for the weekend 12/5 and 12/6. Head north to Okemo or Stowe.
Don't head to NH. They did tell us that passes are still available for purchase thru 12/6. And, if you need lodging the cyber sale continues.

Vail didn't tell us that they resurfaced all the open terrain at Mt. Snow. You'd have to be here and actually go out on the trails to know that. They did tell us they made snow last night - just not where.

They didn't tell us the snow making temps were only marginal here in the Deerfield Valley, so there wasn't a heck of a lot of output. Vail didn't tell us they were making snow on Deer Run and The Gulch and tried to make snow at the Carinthia base. They did tell us 211 guns were running overnight at Mt. Snow, but no word on progress / terrain expansion.

The natives are restless here. I saw a fairly uncomfortable exchange between a liftie and a guest right after the Bluebird opened at 12:30. Both appeared to be unreasonable.

I don't see how Carinthia comes online by the weekend. Deer Run probably does get added.

Tried to make snow at Carinthia base - not very productive:

Gulch - struggled to make snow down low

Beast Patroller

yardsale;c-45087 wroteBeast Patroller is right:: Mt' Snow is as much a flagship now as the Patriots are a dynasty. I'm happy they are open though. It's been a good mental exercise getting out these past few days.

Lucky for you that you can spend your winter at your condo. Unfortunately I still work so my wife & I can't follow the quarantine regulations and that means no skiing at Mount Snow or VT for us. The other issue was we got sucked into buying Epic passes (partly out of fear of losing our credits) and between the Vermont and Connecticut's travel restrictions it looks like any skiing will be done in CT or "maybe" Mass.

ski_it

Or NH right now, with the huge CV-19 numbers about, we are going to attempt to return our passes or get a credit or something .......

Beast Patroller

ski_it;c-45127 wroteOr NH right now, with the huge CV-19 numbers about, we are going to attempt to return our passes or get a credit or something .......

Yeah I know! My state (CT) has 48 states/territories on a travel restriction with a 14 day quarantine upon return or a huge fine if you don't.

Good luck to you ski_it. Let us know how you make out as I haven't had any luck getting anyone to respond. I'm about ready to drive up there (restrictions or not) and walk into the office and deal with them in person.

BTW, if you don't have any luck you might want to call your credit card company and file an appeal with them. Or just wait for the lawsuits to happen and jump on one.

ski_it

Was on hold for over 20 minutes so emailed them asking for refund due to covid. They replied that they would respond within 5 business days. 3 days later they sent this form.
Apparently from the future.

December 7, 2020
ACMClaims.com

In order to process your request for refund, additional documentation is required. At this time, we are requesting for the information below which matches your cancellation reason:

MEDICAL CONDITION:
Please have your physician complete the attached medical form if you have suffered a medical condition that prevents the use of the ski pass for 30 or more consecutive days.

FAMILY MEMBER ILLNESS OR INJURY:
Please have the treating physician complete the attached medical form if a family member who lives in the same residence as you have suffered from a medical condition that prevents the use of the ski pass for 30 or more consecutive days. NOTE: Physician will need to verify name of any primary caregiver should the medical condition require their care and cause loss of use of their ski pass.

PREGNANCY OR ADOPTION:
For Pregnancy - Please have your physician complete the attached medical form if you are unable to use the ski pass due to a pregnancy.
For Adoption – Please provide the Court Order of Adoption or other paperwork confirming the adoption.

DEATH:
Please forward the death certificate, or have your physician complete the attached claim form if you or a family member is unable to use the ski pass for this reason.

ACTIVE MILITARY SERVICE:
Please forward a copy of the military documentation proving deployment or military leave reassignment.

EMPLOYER TRANSFER:
Please forward relocation documents from your employer outlining the terms of the involuntary, employer-initiated transfer.
NOTE: Employer relocation is a qualifying reason if you have been continuously employed within the same organization
for at least one year and involves the relocation of your primary residence of 100 or more miles.
Please provide the following documentation on company letterhead:
The name of your employer
The job title and date of hire
The location you are relocating from and the location where you will be relocated to
The effective date of the relocation and the date you were first notified of the transfer
Your primary residence upon completion of the relocation
Any documentation that would prove your employment with the company of at least 1
year, such as a pay stub
** Employer must confirm that this was an involuntary transfer**

INVOLUNTARY JOB TERMINATION:
Please provide documentation proving the involuntary termination of employment. NOTE: Employer termination is a qualifying reason if you have been continuously employed for at least one year preceding the termination.
Please provide the following documentation:
Date you were first notified of termination
Official termination letter from your employer
Any documentation that would prove your employment with the company of at least 1
year, such as a pay stub
** Employer must confirm that this was an involuntary termination**
NOTE: This provision only applies if you live within 150 miles of a resort for which your pass provides access.

COURT APPEARANCE/JURY DUTY:
Please provide a copy of the legal document proving you were subpoenaed or called for jury duty that prevents you from using your pass for thirty (30) days or more.

NATURAL DISASTER:
Please provide a police report, or other local authority reports or documentation proving your primary residence or destination is uninhabitable due to a natural disaster.

STUDENT RELATED CANCELLATION:
Please provide one of the following documents that is applicable to your specific circumstance: 1) transcripts showing the amount of enrolled credit hours and school transfer documents that indicate you have relocated more than 100 miles from
your current school; 2) a study abroad acceptance letter outlining the dates that you will be out of the country; 3) a copy of your diploma and a letter from your employer that
indicates you have relocated more than 100 miles from your current residence in order to accept the position.

TOURIST OR WORK VISA REJECTION:
Please provide a copy of your visa application and a copy of the formal rejection or denial of your visa.

QUARANTINE:
Please provide a copy of your Physician’s order placing you in quarantine for 30 days or more.

STAY AT HOME ORDER OR TRAVEL RESTRICTIONS:
Please provide proof of government-imposed order(s) requiring you to stay at home or that restricts travel into the United States that prevents you from using your pass for thirty (30) days or more.

RESORT CLOSURE:
Please provide evidence of the resort closure.

Please forward the requested information to your adjuster via mail, fax, or email:

Please be advised that this letter should not be construed that your refund request has been accepted. Once we confirm coverage, pass usage, and review your supporting documentation, we will confirm if your refund request has been accepted, denied or if additional information is required.
If you should have any questions or concerns, please contact the undersigned at the number listed above.

NELSAP

Does it seem like to me there is no way to get a refund for the pass due to travel restrictions? The 30 day minimum may be the problem. They could say "well, you could quarantine for the required 14 days to travel" even though that's not practical for most. It seems like you would have to catch Covid and have a serious long term effects from it to be able to get the $$ back.

jaytrem

Be sure to put in the letter that, if rejected, they will be out of compliance with the Vermont regulations that require a cancellation policy that does not discourage people from obeying the states quarantine policy. Any such rejection letter withh be forwarded to the appropriate authorities.

Beast Patroller

I don't think we'll get a refund for the states travel restrictions either. It looks like the only way to get a refund will be to contact your credit card company and explain that due to the state restrictions you didn't get what you paid for and hope they side with you. Another possibility would be a class action lawsuit. Though a long shot maybe filing a complaint with your state's attorney general may be an option too?

bmwskier

Holy crap! My first thought was that they're asking for some things that are covered by HIPAA.
I've had to go remote due to people being exposed. Our COVID response team is zealous about the privacy of those affected. I don't know what school, adult, kid, or whatever was exposed, just not me or my students.
There's a lot of sharing of private medical information in that being sent off to the nether world of corporate America-- any certificate stating privacy will be protected?

conrad

ski_it;c-45193 wrote3 days later they sent this form.
EMPLOYER TRANSFER:
QUARANTINE:
STAY AT HOME ORDER OR TRAVEL RESTRICTIONS:

Seems like any combination of two out of the three of these would be a good way forward. A note from your employee that you need work at a certain state where Vail is not present. A note from a doctor that you must quarantine and not travel. A copy of the state travel restrictions (ridiculous that they would make you send that since we all know what they are).

The doctor may even be able to scold / call-them-out for their unreasonable policy of expecting visitors to violate state travel restrictions.

Beast Patroller

conrad;c-45206 wrote
ski_it;c-45193 wrote3 days later they sent this form.
EMPLOYER TRANSFER:
QUARANTINE:
STAY AT HOME ORDER OR TRAVEL RESTRICTIONS:
Seems like any combination of two out of the three of these would be a good way forward. A note from your employee that you need work at a certain state where Vail is not present. A note from a doctor that you must quarantine and not travel. A copy of the state travel restrictions (ridiculous that they would make you send that since we all know what they are).

The doctor may even be able to scold / call-them-out for their unreasonable policy.

I think Vail would argue the question on the state travel restrictions due to the fact that people can enter the states after quarantining. Also they'll claim you can go to a Vail resort in another state.

For me in CT the only other state I can travel to w/o quarantine requirements that Vail has a resort in would be New York (Hunter Mtn.). I certainly didn't buy a pass to travel 2+ hrs. to go skiing especially when my second home is 10 mins. from Mount Snow! On top of that good luck getting a reservation with everyone from CT, NY, & NJ trying to at the same time because of all the travel restriction.

Cannonball

DEATH:
Please forward the death certificate, or have your physician complete the attached claim form if you or a family member is unable to use the ski pass for this reason.

?? You ?? You can't use your pass because you're dead, so you have to submit the form?

conrad

"Season pass sales through September 18, 2020 for the upcoming 2020/2021 North American ski season increased approximately 18% in units and decreased approximately 4% in sales dollars as compared to the period in the prior year through September 20, 2019..."

"We continue to maintain significant liquidity with $360 million of cash on hand as of August 31, 2020 and $593 million of availability under our U.S. and Whistler Blackcomb revolving credit facilities."

http://investors.vailresorts.com/news-releases/news-release-details/vail-resorts-reports-fiscal-2020-fourth-quarter-and-full-year

thebigo

conrad;c-45210 wrote"Season pass sales through September 18, 2020 for the upcoming 2020/2021 North American ski season increased approximately 18% in units and decreased approximately 4% in sales dollars as compared to the period in the prior year through September 20, 2019..."

"We continue to maintain significant liquidity with $360 million of cash on hand as of August 31, 2020 and $593 million of availability under our U.S. and Whistler Blackcomb revolving credit facilities."

http://investors.vailresorts.com/news-releases/news-release-details/vail-resorts-reports-fiscal-2020-fourth-quarter-and-full-year

My understanding is that the 18% growth number did not include peak passes; sales were roughly flat when peak passes are included.

NewEnglandSkier13

So, how many of you will be buying Epic passes next season? :D

Seriously though, do any of you think you'll buy a Vail pass next season at this rate? If so, why?

xwhaler

Never again will I do business with Vail. I still don't have my pass, unable to reach anyone to get the free pass for my under 5 yr old son. Their entire business attitude is off putting. I have $1800 in with them and can't wait until I can buy the White Mtn Super pass this spring. Sort of my own fault for thinking this was the best path forward for a Covid ski yr (4 mtns in my home state of NH seemed to make sense along with night ski Crotched option)

Just a really cavalier attitude towards their customers has me looking elsewhere for my family spend next yr and beyond

Remski

Once and done with them! With none of the 4 in NH open yet where people can still travel to, but 4 in Vt. open where their are all kinds of restrictions makes no sense. And the bull crap about not being able to get a refund without doctor’s note makes me feel like I’m in High School being out for a sickness. I hope they lose their shirt over this lack of sensitivity.

Chuckstah

Most likely one and done for me also. But if it's in the $300 range again it will be worth purchasing again, even with all the BS. Limited local options.

bousquet19

NewEnglandSkier13;c-45213 wroteSo, how many of you will be buying Epic passes next season? :D

Seriously though, do any of you think you'll buy a Vail pass next season at this rate? If so, why?

No way, unless Vail provides refunds to passholders or otherwise makes good on the inaccessibility of skiing at their resorts this season.

Woody

shpride

I’ll probably buy again. Not pleased with the early season so far but with a 2nd home near Wildcat and Attitash and a yearly trip to Breck with a fee place to stay (not this year) the Epic pass makes the most sense for me.

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